Go to hell Dook!!!
- Thread starter matt 1976
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GTHD is what I said after the game was over too. Their players were acting so cocky all game. How does humble pie taste?
I hope Duke wins the division. It would be a farce for Georgia Tech to be in ACC championship game.
And it wouldn't if duke won it? Are you kidding? With every duke win, the reputation of the ACC sinks more and more. Thank god y'all beat them because there was some insane talk about how they might wind up in the Orange bowl. Duke...in the Orange bowl. I mean, seriously? That's the kind of thing the ACC can't recover from.
GT is a bad option as well but certainly not as embarrassing as duke. I was pulling for Miami but FSU pulled yet another horseshoe out of their ass.
As I have said for years, there are only 3 schools worthy of carrying the ACC banner:
FSU
Miami
VT
these 3 schools must all win 10-12 games a year for ACC to have any respect. No one else can carry the banner.
FSU
Miami
VT
these 3 schools must all win 10-12 games a year for ACC to have any respect. No one else can carry the banner.
Yeah, not sure why he's saying that. I mean no offense to VT at all, but UNC's brand is infinitely stronger than VT's. So why would it not be good if UNC was a consistent winner? That makes no sense. I'd argue that Clemson's brand is as strong as VTs and would be worthy of carrying the ACC banner. Miami, meh, I guess. FSU, for sure.
UNC is a basketball school. had one fairly good run for a couple seasons under Mack Brown, then tanked out. Then the Adorable Butch Davis came in with his rogues, violated some NCAA rules and ruined the program with shady recruits. UNC will never get any respect as a football school in my opinion. Sure they may have a winning record here and there, but they'll never be a FSU, Miami or even VT.
I think Miami's national brand in football is similar to UNC's in bball. Clemson has no significant brand other than the last few hi-profile winning seasons, despite having a NC. GT has a NC since Clemson got one.
VT's flavor of the month fb brand was pretty good from 99 on through a good part of the 00s because of Vick and a notorious defense but that's all but gone. It would probably pick right back up after a couple great seasons in a row but right now Clemson's is obviously stronger, though not really what I'd call "brand".
Basketball, football, whatever. That's irrelevant. The point is that the UNC brand is known from coast to coast. You will see people donning the light blue and white from Seattle to Miami and everywhere in between. The UNC brand is exponentially bigger than pretty much everyone in the ACC except for FSU and that's debatable. That's why, much to the chagrin of many, as UNC goes, the ACC goes. If UNC decided to leave the ACC, it would absolutely cripple the league.
Now, we've certainly been constant underachievers in football - since before time began. And I doubt we'll ever be more than a B+ program (if we can ever even get there). But the point remains that IF UNC could field a consistent winner, it would be the best thing for the ACC - especially the Coastal division.
How does fake classes help the UNCheat brand.......it's going to hurt the brand in a big way if the NCAA does its job. Schools nothing more than a piece of crap with coaches, professors and administrators willing to cover up one of the worst academic scandles ever. How's that for brand recognition......love the new slogan.....UNC, fake classes with fake degrees!!!!
I think you're a bit full of yourself, which is typical for UNC alumni and fans. Even under the circumstances, you guys show no humility with the exception of '71. Duke is nearly if not just as hyped as a brand and so is Miami, and to a lesser degree, FSU. Losing UNC would hurt the ACC briefly but it would recover. Right now, people who aren't UNC fans just want UNC punished, severely and proportionately in accord with the cheating that helped produce multiple titles and assisted in building that "brand" you're so proud of. Hopefully the NCAA will do the right thing this time around but I'm not holding my breath.
For football, Miami and FSU carry the banner for the ACC with all their NCs. Then Clemson with their one and GT with their shared NC when Bobby Ross was coaching them.
In basketball its Dook, UNC, then the rest of us with VT at the bottom. But that will change in a few years.
In basketball its Dook, UNC, then the rest of us with VT at the bottom. But that will change in a few years.
Some of our newer members, as time moves along, will also stake a place at the table.
NCs- Pitt & Syracuse have em.
basketball- any of the new members Lou, Syr Pitt are top-tier nationally.
Hilarious. Just because some gangster wears a flat brimmed UNC hat, don't think for a moment he isn't donning his Detroit Lions hat the next day. I think you over state your "brand" which has now become a laughingstock. Yeah, UNC is popular in Norrth Carolina. Film at 11:00.
I also think some some here may understate the Clemson brand, but none as laughingly as your overstatement.
Pitt, And especially Syr, have big brands up north. Clem, Lou, FSU, Miami, Duke, ..big brands, all.
That post was full of it. If the NCAA punishes UNC proportionately to 18 years of fraudulent classes to keep athletes in all sports eligible that would be the death penalty for a few years. Then we would see how much the ACC was crippled by their absence, and I doubt we would even miss them all that much. And I got news for Dick - whenever you see anyone in a UNC hat coast to coast its not for a football program that hasn't even won its own conference championship in 35 years.
I travel the South and Southeast a lot. I see very little signs of UNC anywhere outside of North Carolina.
Last year I went to a UNC-Alabama softball game in Chapel Hill. Alabama fans out numbered UNC fans 20-1 in their own stadium.
Last year I went to a UNC-Alabama softball game in Chapel Hill. Alabama fans out numbered UNC fans 20-1 in their own stadium.
"As UNC goes, the ACC goes"????? Are you kidding me? The ACC does not need UNC. What exactly would the ACC be missing? A terrible football program that cannot win no matter how much they cheat? A basketball program that also cheats and is currently behind Duke, Syracuse, UVA, and Louisville anyway?
UNC is a nice school, and I have nothing against the school itself, but the ACC would not miss the sports programs. Just in the last few years, FSU has a football title and Duke and Louisville have basketball titles, so what do they need UNC for? I would say maybe their "looks" (it is a pretty campus), but the latest scandal has ruined even that. Instead of waiting for all of their penalties and making the ACC look bad, maybe UNC can just go away. Just leave. Disappear. Maybe try the MAC or C-USA.
UNC is a nice school, and I have nothing against the school itself, but the ACC would not miss the sports programs. Just in the last few years, FSU has a football title and Duke and Louisville have basketball titles, so what do they need UNC for? I would say maybe their "looks" (it is a pretty campus), but the latest scandal has ruined even that. Instead of waiting for all of their penalties and making the ACC look bad, maybe UNC can just go away. Just leave. Disappear. Maybe try the MAC or C-USA.
Right. Louisville won in 2013 and duke won it in 2010. Hmmm, I seem to have forgotten but who won it the year before duke? Nevermind, that's ancient history.
One way you can judge the strength of a university's brand is to look at apparel sales. Last year UNC was 9th nationally and easily the highest ranking ACC school. FSU was next at 21 (VT coming in with a respectable #27). And that's in the midst of the "scandal". In past years, we've led the nation. I kind of doubt all those sales were with people in the state of NC or at the Alabama/NC softball game (WTF did that comment mean anyway?).
Another way to judge brand strength is how often do your teams play on national TV? Obviously, our basketball team is on TV regularly - over 20 times this year. But now even our mediocre (at best) football team is getting Thursday night ESPN football games (3 Thursday night games in the past 5 seasons).
The last 4 years have definitely left UNC with a black eye. But that doesn't at all mean that's it's impacted our brand recognition. And in 5 years, the only people that will remember this whole ordeal will be message board posters and ABCers. Casual sports fans won't remember or care about any of this. Carolina will still be viewed as a top academic University with a very strong brand and a very strong athletic department.
That's an absurd statement. I started to post some numbers but realized that by doing so, I'm actually giving that statement some credence. All-time, none of those programs measure up. In the last 5 years, UNC is right there with the rest - except UVA which doesn't even belong after one good season.
Get real.
I ignore Syracuse and Louisville as being in the ACC. They should go back to Big East where they came from.
Yeah, what does this ACC need in an additional enormous cash cow and one of the most recognizable brands in the entire country? Don't be obtuse. What you are talking about is recency and in that respect UNC hasn't much to show for, but the brand is always there. Just like a Miami, FSU, Alabama or Notre Dame, the brand or worth thereof might diminish during down periods but it never goes away. What if the SEC had gotten rid of Alabama during its down years? According to your logic, they would have been expendable based on recency and because there are a few other successes whose longevity cannot be determined then it's okay to get rid of them. What happens when Coach K retires at Duke? Boheim at Syracuse? Or Pitino retires at Louisville? Both will happen in the foreseeable future and there's no guarantee they won't both suffer significant down periods. Do you still not want a UNC when there is that power vacuum?
You are basically, and stupidly, supposing that these current "powers" (I hesitate to call either UVa or Syracuse powers at this point in time) will remain in power in perpetuity and that UNC is therefore expendable. That's extremely short-sighted and ignores the history and nature of college sports almost altogether.
The fact remains that in the modern ACC era (2004-2014) UNC has 2 national titles in basketball (Duke and Louisville both have 1 a piece, Syracuse 0, UVa not even close to 1) 6 regular season titles, 2 conference tournament titles and an NCAA appearance every year with the exception of 2010. To suggest they are expendable is just stupid--there's really no glossing over it.
Louisville has never won anything as a member of ACC, and I hope they never do.
Granted they did win in their previous conference.
Granted they did win in their previous conference.
My statement is not absurd at all. UNC has not made a final four the past 5 seasons, and hasn't even made the Elite 8 the past 2, and the ACC has survived just fine. You can disagree with me, but it is not absurd of me to think that UNC will finish behind the 4 teams I listed this year when each of the past 2 years they have lost 10 or more games.
Who cares about all time? A long time ago, Duke stunk at basketball, and Syracuse and Louisville were not in the ACC. You earlier said, "If UNC decided to leave the ACC, it would absolutely cripple the league." My point is the ACC would survive without UNC. No way would it cripple the league. No one program is bigger than its conference. Alabama could leave the SEC right now, and take their tradition and national titles with them, and guess what? The SEC would survive.
What's stupid about your argument is that the ACC is always going to be fine without UNC. Just because UNC has been down the past five years doesn't mean they won't be a valuable asset 10-15 years from now. 6 years ago FSU was irrelevant in football, not even selling out home games, and now they're national front-runners. Surely even you with your childish, circumscribed understanding of the world can see that UNC's importance lay as much in its potential due to brand as the immediacy of its accomplishments?
Whoa...we haven't made the Elite Eight in 2 whole years? I guess we're on the way out. Newsflash - making the elite eight is kind of hard. I think we should get a pass from not making it in the past 2 years. Did you really mean to type that ridiculous statement?
But for argument's sake let's say that not making the elite eight in 2 consecutive years is evidence of a program going downhill...what then do you make of duke's first game exits from the NCAA tournament 2 of the last 3 years and how come that doesn't appear to factor into your thinking when ranking them above the Heels for this coming season?
And what evidence are you using to suggest UVa will be good again? They lost their team leader in Harris who was also at worst their second best player. They also lost their best defender, second best leader and low post stalwart in Mitchell. They also don't have the benefit of the unbalanced schedule this year like they did last year. So tell me again what you're using to rank them above UNC.
Louisville will be pretty good - they always are. But they lost their leader in Russ Smith and frankly the only guy that other teams feared. Harrel is a good player, but he's a garbage man. He doesn't create his own offense. Teams don't need to gameplan for him. But Pitino is a good coach so they'll be ok.
Syracuse, one of the most overrated teams in the history of college basketball. Year in and year out they play an embarrassingly weak schedule, pile up a bunch of early season wins, jump in the rankings only to come back to earth when they start playing real teams. Excuse me if I'm not the least bit worried about them
Then there's the Heels, who bring back everyone on the team except a slightly underachieving James McAdoo. We have the best guard in the country, and better depth than pretty much any team in the nation minus UK. We did lose 10 games each of the last 2 seasons. The first was on the heels of a mass exodus when we lost 4 All American caliber players in Zeller, Henson, Barnes and Marshall. The second of the 10 loss seasons was the product of not having our best player at all throughout the season. We lost some early games we shouldn't have but it was because we were relying on players that weren't orginally going to play, let alone be integral parts of the rotation. We also had guys playing out of position. And if you remember correctly, we went on a 14 game win streak after getting things nailed down.
The media and coaches have UNC at #6 in the country and yet you are making a case that we are behind the other teams you mention. I guess it could happen. But I have a feeling you're just being a "hater" instead of basing your comments on something real.
Ok, I'll give a little here. I'll take back my comment that it would cripple the league. But the financial ramifications of UNC leaving the ACC would be more far more impactful than if any other team left the league. The ACC would probably survive. But make no mistake, UNC is the most powerful school in the league. That's really not debatable. Our brand, our location, our history, our funding, our academic reputation (yes, even in the face of the "scandal"), etc make UNC the big dog. I'm not trying to measure dicks here. I'm just talking reality.
UVA will be just fine this year, they will play a 9-10 man rotation and have good freshman that will see a lot of playing time. As long as they play Bennett's defense they will be in just about every game with a chance to win. The question a Tarhole needs to ask is can UNCheat score consistently , that was an issue for you last year. I guess if your boys practice instead of going to class they can fix that issue......
Bragging on anything UNC related from the last 20 years is to advocate for cheating and dishonesty. Everything UNC has accomplished is an ill-gotten gain, achieved not by merit, but by artifice and immorality. Don't you get that yet?!
Syr and Duke and Lou will be just fine when their coaches retire. You underestimate them all, badly, if you think not.
Syr and Duke and Lou will be just fine when their coaches retire. You underestimate them all, badly, if you think not.
gunslinger,
I agree making the final 8 is not easy, but Louisville, Duke, and Syracuse have done it the past 2 years, so that is yet another reason why you should not be so surprised that I have theses teams ahead of the Heels. You asked why I have Duke ahead of UNC? How about a 3-1 record against UNC the last 2 years, and a 27-9 ACC record compared to UNC's 25-11?
Why will UVA be good again? Why wouldn't they? Bennett is a great coach, and they have talent. Are you really using the unbalanced schedule talk as a reason why they went 19-2 in the ACC last year? In addition to UVA, 4 other ACC teams had winning league records, and UVA went 6-1 against them.
We agree Louisville will be good, but I find it interesting you would write off Syracuse, and you are wrong about how they did last year. They did not play a weak schedule at all. OOC, they played Minn., Cal, Baylor, Ind., St. john's, and Villanova. They made UNC look pretty bad when they whipped them, so I'm not sure why you would say you are not worried about them. Also, they ended up 14-4 in the ACC, so I'm not sure why you would say they played a weak schedule and then came back to earth.
If you want to focus on where the media has UNC, then yes, they have them #6, but they also have Duke 4, Louisville 7, and Virginia 9, so am I really that much of a "hater" if I have UNC behind them?
As for your last paragraph, I will simply stick with my opinion that the ACC would survive without UNC.
I agree making the final 8 is not easy, but Louisville, Duke, and Syracuse have done it the past 2 years, so that is yet another reason why you should not be so surprised that I have theses teams ahead of the Heels. You asked why I have Duke ahead of UNC? How about a 3-1 record against UNC the last 2 years, and a 27-9 ACC record compared to UNC's 25-11?
Why will UVA be good again? Why wouldn't they? Bennett is a great coach, and they have talent. Are you really using the unbalanced schedule talk as a reason why they went 19-2 in the ACC last year? In addition to UVA, 4 other ACC teams had winning league records, and UVA went 6-1 against them.
We agree Louisville will be good, but I find it interesting you would write off Syracuse, and you are wrong about how they did last year. They did not play a weak schedule at all. OOC, they played Minn., Cal, Baylor, Ind., St. john's, and Villanova. They made UNC look pretty bad when they whipped them, so I'm not sure why you would say you are not worried about them. Also, they ended up 14-4 in the ACC, so I'm not sure why you would say they played a weak schedule and then came back to earth.
If you want to focus on where the media has UNC, then yes, they have them #6, but they also have Duke 4, Louisville 7, and Virginia 9, so am I really that much of a "hater" if I have UNC behind them?
As for your last paragraph, I will simply stick with my opinion that the ACC would survive without UNC.
