Another crap the bed Saturday. A lot of hard effort, but critical mistakes and some boneheaded playcalling leaves us at 3-4. Will a losing season (very real possibility) be enough for Babcock to tell Frank 'resign or be fired'?
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- Thread starter SamAdamsHokie
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Miami - 0 turnovers: VT - 4 turnovers. I didn't see Frank have a single fumble or interception.
Good question. When Whit and Beams met last year after the season was over Whit stated that they both expected improvement over what we did last year .Beamer later confirmed this.
We are going to have to go all out to show improvement over last year. We have Brewer back but we also have some tough games ahead.
We are going to have to go all out to show improvement over last year. We have Brewer back but we also have some tough games ahead.
No, he didn't. Coaches job to prepare the team to succeed. Letting the qb development situation get to this point is on the coaching staff and the head coach. He makes over $2m a year, where are the results to match. It's been a steadily accelerating decline since the game against FSU for all the marbles back in 2000.
I think this was a winnable game. Right at the start, Motley looked lost(the "fumble" that produced the first Cane's TD) and it didn't get any better. I thought we waited way too long to replace Motley being that Brewer was available. It should have been Brewer or Lawson after the second turnover at least. Confusing play calling, why did Motley come back in after Brewer replaced him? In spite of his fumble, McMillian was having a whale of a game and all of a sudden Edmunds is in the game for some time? It's like we don't know what to do, the team has no rhythm and when they do, it's either a change in play calling pattern or a penalty. Our time management looked like a case book on how not to mange it correctly. The D didn't look like world beaters but they were out on the field a lot and Miami has a good QB. Edmunds got beaten for a couple, but the turnovers put them in bad spot.
Where do we go from here? I think it becomes Brewer and then Lawson. Ford and Hodges are going to have to get at least 8 or 10 balls thrown to them a game and McMillian is going to have to get most of the carries. Otherwise, we struggle to get six and the Va. game may be a disappointment this year.
Not to take away from the other teams, but we are giving away more games than usual this year. Every game looks like Akron or JMU. We're lost.
Where do we go from here? I think it becomes Brewer and then Lawson. Ford and Hodges are going to have to get at least 8 or 10 balls thrown to them a game and McMillian is going to have to get most of the carries. Otherwise, we struggle to get six and the Va. game may be a disappointment this year.
Not to take away from the other teams, but we are giving away more games than usual this year. Every game looks like Akron or JMU. We're lost.
SAH, I don't think it has been that long but at least I have noticed a decline in VTs abilities over the last 5 years. As a Nole, and I have stated this on this board several times, the problem with legacy coaches is that they start to feel entitled to their position no matter the outcome of the games or season. Bobby B once made a comment at the end of his reign that 50% of the teams in American lost last week, he seemed to forget the whole point in getting paid millions of dollars is to win, not make excuses for loosing. The ACC needs VT and Miami to be relevant to get the SEC bias quitted down some. Good luck and it will take a united front to get Frank gone, especially your big money boosters.
Trust Me, I was probably overly wound up earlier but I stand by the slow decline since that game. We went from one quarter shy of a title game (damn your Noles!!! lol) to winning conference championships and playing in big league bowls to ten win seasons and still good but not marquee bowls. Now we're down to having to eek by our in state foe to just get eligible to play in a bowl in Annapolis sometime during Christmas week? We used to be relevant on the big boy stage, now we're just another middle of the pack or further back ACC squad. Frank 'n' staff refuse to see it that way. Yeah, they get paid the big bucks but that means there should be results. Your comment about Bobby towards the end of his tenure sure sounds like something Frank would say. Rough days in Blacksburg, really hoping it turns for the better at some point.
You mean like "its hard to beat ECU"?
I saw (live in Miami) a coach that called for 2 timeouts as Miami had the ball with 58 seconds left in the 1st half. These 2 timeouts allowed Miami to get a long pass play, followed by a roughing the passer penalty. Ultimately, Miami scored before the half. Instead of getting the ball tied at 13 to start the 2nd half, VT was down 7.
I also saw VT run Edmunds on a 3rd and 1 in the 2nd half. Edmunds runs straight up and doesn't convert. Why wasn't Travon Macmillan in the game?
Why not try a 46 yard FG instead of going for it on 4th down?
VT, with Motley's 1st quarter fumble, literally game Miami 14 to 17 points.
At what point do you hold the head coach accountable?
Tech called the time outs because the d was supposed to force a punt and get the ball back. Backfired and Frank let them complete a long pass play and then committed pass interference. Edmunds didn't get the first down and It's easy to second guess that Mcmillian would have. I agree that we should have gone for the field goal even though we needed only one yard. Motley had three turnovers and continued to stare down receivers all night. Hopefully he will go back to being a backup and we'll have a chance to win 3 more games and get to a bowl. Brewer took some big hits and seemed to hold up. At what point do you hold the players accountable?
It looked to me like Golden baited Frank into that. Run a couple of hand offs to make Frank think he's going to have time to get the ball back and use his time outs to stop the clock. Then catch Frank's defense napping and go up top for the big yardage play, still with plenty of time - courtesy of Frank's time outs. If that's what Golden was up to it looks like it worked pretty good - they got 7.
The odd thing was in that time and down situation for Miami there was very little chance VT would have scored anyway when it got the ball back without a big play of its own, and the Hokies don't make too many of those. My opinion is Golden played Frank like a trumpet on that last drive before the half.
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I agree. It's not like we were stopping Miami. We were in the run but not in the air. Just a bad decision on our part. We were getting the ball in the second half anyway. I think we were lucky to be where we were. Motley had already had a shaky first half and we had still come back on the road. Just another erratic call. Like we were going to light it up if we got it back. A gift for Miami along with the Motley drop on the early possession.
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Time for it. Many kudos and thanks for what you did coach, but it's time for you to enjoy your golden years.
Not going to blame Beamer for everything yesterday. The timeouts were great calls IMO you trust your D you had them behind the chains. Had a chance to get the ball with great field pos with a little time to go. Give the blame where it should go. Love Maddy but he is too experienced of a player to jump right there. We just do not have to over all talent on our team anymore and it is obvious. Miami tried to let us win that game and we could not do it. Our Defense (I DO NOT CARE WHAT THE NUMBERS SAY) Is really not that great. We get smoked up front every week, QB's have all day to throw even when we blitz. If Dadi is hurt he does not need to be out there. He is wasting space to be honest he just tries to bump the other team and hope they go down. These are D1 ballplayers they are not just going to fall over because you are close. Williams jumped offside and had a roughing penalty that was huge as well. Soft , undisciplined team and that I will blame on Frank. I know he built this program but why let him leave it the way he found it??
I thought calling the timeouts was the right move, but you convinced me it wasn't. As you said, our D isn't that great, we get smoked up front, and QBs have all day to throw even when we blitz. Considering all that, we should have been content with a tie game and to get the ball to start the second half.
If it had worked it would have been a great call. One thing is absolute, arm chair coaches get the call right in hindsight every time.
What I cant figure out is why brewer didn't play the whole game? It may be that he just was not ready even though he was cleared by medical. He may have been a tad gun shy about getting into the fray on the field.Neither of these teams had anything to brag about as far as their showing on the field went. Another thing that bothers me is the let down by the d. In years past the o could falter but the d stepped up.Why not now. Some say we don't get the talent because of our recruiting.I think a underlying cause is more to blame.What it is I don't know but it just seems all our coachies are just play acting and waiting for the other shoe to drop.I guess time will tell.By the way watch what happens next week,we come back and look like a team to be dealt with.If the fire can be lit under them after a loss like this next week ,why not ever week?
The coaching staff wanted to give Brewer another week and would have if Motley hadn't turned it over again. Brewer was the last chance for a comeback. We are very thin everywhere on defense and our secondary is not all that experienced or talented. We recruit on about the same level as the other ACC schools with the exceptions of Clemson and FSU. I think the team will play with a lot of emotion next week but it takes a lot more than that to win. Football is a complex game and unlike hoops, the ball isn't round and can take some weird bounces. I predict the team that runs the ball better and has fewer turnovers will win next week. I sure hope it is us.
I agree regarding armchair coaches, but given our less than stellar defense, the fact we came back to tie the game at 13 after a Motley-wrapped TD gift to Miami, and VT was going to have hardly any time left to mount any kind of a drive; the timeout calls were not playing the percentages.
Lastly, I read in the Richmond Times Dispatch this morning that Frank thought he had a chance to block a punt if we held them. How often did VT block a punt when we had GOOD special teams? We didn't come close to blocking any of their punts all day. I personally think that Frank has lost it. Five more games left for Frank. We will not go 3 and 2 against Duke, BC, GT, UNC, and UVA to become bowl-eligible.
I hold the players accountable AS WELL AS the coaches. Coaches are supposed to put the players in the best position to succeed by managing the game. I don't believe VT's coaches have done that in recent memory. Our QB play by Motley is just not good. I'll be surprised to see him much for the rest of this year if Brewer can stay healthy. Defensively, we give up too many big plays. Some of this is due to Bud Foster being too aggressive. Some is due to the lack of discipline (penalties) and poor tackling.
Agreed it was stupid call to go for it on 4th and 4. A makeable FG there would've put VT down only by 7 on Hokies last possession and with Brewer not pressed to try for 2 scores in closing minutes, I feel much better re Hokies chance.
Re: Future VT head coach, I pray that it is Not Shane Beamer. Pshaw, Shane cannot even manage the running backs! WTH did it take 5 games to pick the McMillan as the best running back and then pull him when he got to 99 rushing yards?
If VT was determined to start the 2nd string QB and keep him in the game until he'd buried the Hokies, why don't they have more option plays like the one McMillan easily scored on. Further, since Motley can't take his eyes off the receiver he is gonna pass to (open or not) WTH don't they have plays to let this running QB roll out (instead of getting pounded in the pocket as he's staring down his passing target) loosening up the defense and making some short-medium range passes to VT's very capable TE's OR since the defense is not 100% sure whether he's gonna throw it or tuck it in and run, Motley would also have the option to do what he does best - RUN!
VT''s biggest mistake however, was not bringing in Brewer or Lawson when Motley was under performing, that is on Frank Beamer!!!
Re: Future VT head coach, I pray that it is Not Shane Beamer. Pshaw, Shane cannot even manage the running backs! WTH did it take 5 games to pick the McMillan as the best running back and then pull him when he got to 99 rushing yards?
If VT was determined to start the 2nd string QB and keep him in the game until he'd buried the Hokies, why don't they have more option plays like the one McMillan easily scored on. Further, since Motley can't take his eyes off the receiver he is gonna pass to (open or not) WTH don't they have plays to let this running QB roll out (instead of getting pounded in the pocket as he's staring down his passing target) loosening up the defense and making some short-medium range passes to VT's very capable TE's OR since the defense is not 100% sure whether he's gonna throw it or tuck it in and run, Motley would also have the option to do what he does best - RUN!
VT''s biggest mistake however, was not bringing in Brewer or Lawson when Motley was under performing, that is on Frank Beamer!!!
We are a pressure defense team that cant get to the QB and when we do, the QBs decision to throw has little risk because our DBs wont turn and make a play on the ball and stand a 50/50 chance of getting flagged for holding or pass interference. The worst that could happen is a bad throw or the reciever drops the pass. We dont punish the QB and get in his head like we used to. We used to make good QBs look mediocre, now we make mediocre QBs look good! And If that wasnt enough, our D-line is undisciplined and drawing too many damn penalties (and at the worst times).
Our talent is as good as its always been on defense, its not like weve had stables of 5star talent in the past. They are just not a fundamentally sound and prepared unit, which goes on the coaching.
I tried to tell everyone that Loeffler wasnt a OC when he come on board. A decent QB coach that had to be bailed out at his last two stops by the head coach mid season. He does what hes told or he wouldnt be here in the first place. None of our QBs could start on any of the top 25 teams. Its took half the season for the RB coach to see what most of us seen by the second game of the season with McMilan. And for Gods sake WTH does it take to field a damn O-line?!!!!! Were on our second heralded SEC OL coach and I cant see any improvement. Weve got a freak TE that is seldom utilized unless the QB is starring a damn hole through him! We basically have WRs and a punting game.
sad part is when this is finally over and the toilet gets flushed, like most programs we will probably make a terrible hire next and THEN make a homerun hire on the second coach 4-5 years down the road.
Our talent is as good as its always been on defense, its not like weve had stables of 5star talent in the past. They are just not a fundamentally sound and prepared unit, which goes on the coaching.
I tried to tell everyone that Loeffler wasnt a OC when he come on board. A decent QB coach that had to be bailed out at his last two stops by the head coach mid season. He does what hes told or he wouldnt be here in the first place. None of our QBs could start on any of the top 25 teams. Its took half the season for the RB coach to see what most of us seen by the second game of the season with McMilan. And for Gods sake WTH does it take to field a damn O-line?!!!!! Were on our second heralded SEC OL coach and I cant see any improvement. Weve got a freak TE that is seldom utilized unless the QB is starring a damn hole through him! We basically have WRs and a punting game.
sad part is when this is finally over and the toilet gets flushed, like most programs we will probably make a terrible hire next and THEN make a homerun hire on the second coach 4-5 years down the road.
I agree, but on one of our offsides calls, the left guard flinched plain as day, which caused THREE VT players to jump (one crossed the line and went into the backfield). They showed the replay several times and it was very obviously the offense that should have been called, but the refs blew the call.
This might even be the same play we're talking about.
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